Topic REMINDER -- WILL & GRACE from the General Chit-Chat forum.
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| Author | Topic: REMINDER -- WILL & GRACE |
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 GYPSY1527
Registered User
Registered:
2/20/2004
From:
New Jersey
Fav. BP Song: With So Little to be Sure of
Fav. BP Show: Gypsy
Fav. BP Character: Dot
Fav. BP CD: Sondheim Ect.
| posted: 5/12/2006 at 9:55:47 AM ET
I'm glad others besides myself enjoyed her part as much as I did! Its just good fun not high art and she did a great job! I just finished watching the tap dance part...I too thought she was going to hit the plant behind her. Too funny!
| Karen
Registered User
Registered:
5/3/2002 | posted: 5/12/2006 at 10:52:16 AM ET
I guess I'm being the Grinch, but wasn't the whole thing just 40 minutes of cheaply cynical, low brow insult humor, lacking any meaningful point of view or characterization?
It bore no relation to real life nor did it create an enjoyable artificial world. It was just a big, dumb, nothing. Like a 12 year old's idea of sophistication. An especially bratty and insensitive 12 year old.
You're probably right that it's no worse than any of the other current sit-coms. That's the really depressing part.
|  Sister Rose
Registered User
Registered:
5/4/2004
From:
NYC | posted: 5/12/2006 at 11:38:17 AM ET
Karen - No offense to our friends here who may watch these shows, but I think you just defined NBC's "Must See TV" demographics...
This is why shows like "Arrested Development" don't last - it takes brains to understand them.
http://sarahbsadventures.blogspot.com/
| Anonymous
Anonymous Poster
From Internet Network:
71.67.113.x | posted: 5/12/2006 at 11:49:53 AM ET
Did anyone think her voice sounded really low and gravely last night? i'm afraid she might be showing her age. *sigh*
| Karen
Registered User
Registered:
5/3/2002 | posted: 5/12/2006 at 1:38:45 PM ET
Sarah, when I was in high school the advertised "must see TV" night was Saturday. The line-up consisted of All In The Family, MASH, Mary Tyler Moore, Bob Newhart, and Carol Burnett. Those shows managed to be genuinely funny and clever and at the same time had a basic humanity to them. Sure, it was just light entertainment and not every episode was a masterpiece, but at the same time they treated the audience like half-way intelligent adults who possibly had a little common decency.
What happened? I can't help but think something went terribly wrong in pop culture. The show last night was not only unfunny, it was just plain mean-spirited and cruel. There was almost a sadistic mentality to the "humor." Turning on the laughtrack after someone is punched in the stomach for no reason? The promos for an upcoming show had someone's head being stuck in a toilet. None of that is anything I can understand, relate to, or laugh at.
| Sister Rose
Registered User
Registered:
5/4/2004
From:
NYC | posted: 5/12/2006 at 1:56:47 PM ET
A sign of the times?
http://sarahbsadventures.blogspot.com/
|  leebee
Registered User
Registered:
1/19/2004
Fav. BP Song: Being Alive
Fav. BP Show: Sunday In The Park With George
| posted: 5/12/2006 at 2:53:19 PM ET
I think her voice has sounded a little different ever since the long run of Gypsy performances. I kind of like it actually.
Karen, I remember that classic Saturday night TV line up so well. As a kid I would always stay over at my grandparents each Saturday, and they were ardent All In The Family and Carol Burnett fans. In fact it was probably seeing Bernadette on Carol's show way back then that made me a permanent fan for the rest of my life!
| jmslsu01
Registered User
Registered:
6/9/2003
From:
northern VA | posted: 5/12/2006 at 6:34:55 PM ET
quote:
It was just a big, dumb, nothing.
Now, I agree with you on this. It's a shame, because the show used to be interesting.
Jenn
| Karen
Registered User
Registered:
5/3/2002 | posted: 5/12/2006 at 6:57:07 PM ET
I'm not sure I agree about her voice being different since Gypsy. To my ears, her voice has completely recovered from that. It didn't sound low or gravelly to me last night.
Now she was definitely speaking in a monotone, but I take that as the way she was directed to act the part. Why? I have no idea, but then I have no idea why anything in that episode was done the way it was.
Certainly when you hear Bernadette's speaking voice now, either on stage or in person, it sounds clear and very much as always, without any hoarse or rough quality.
|  Christine-NYC
Registered User
Registered:
3/23/2002
From:
New York City
Fav. BP Song: With So Little to be Sure Of
Fav. BP Show: Gypsy
Fav. BP Character: Marie (insert last name) lol There's a few
Fav. BP CD: Bernadette Peters Loves Rogers and Hammerstein
| posted: 5/12/2006 at 7:32:16 PM ET
I find that any sitcom that I do watch, are the ones that are in reruns because they have ended the series. The new shows are just not funny.
The only new sitcom I currently enjoy is "The New Adventures of Old Christine"  And NOT just because my name is in the title. lol
I just think the characters are fun and the story line flows well.
<3CMH<3
|  IMeanHeKneadsMe
Registered User
Registered:
5/12/2006
From:
Alabama | posted: 5/12/2006 at 7:37:35 PM ET
I think you kind of just have to take Will and Grace as it is. And it has been kind of campy, silly humor for a while now. It's one of my favorite shows, but it's the second to last episode and I think they've run out of things to write about really. Which sort of stinks for the closure to the characters. The neat thing is that it looks like with the way they ended things, if the show stayed on "Gin" would show up again.
Okay, you guys are going to kick me, but I enjoyed it for the shear fact that I got to see her in something else. I thought she was the highpoint of the episode. I actually laughed in places where she was speaking where they didn't insert it. The character was over the top. She played it well. It was good to see her dance and she was beautiful. "I could have been on Broadway." Just think if she would have been on in season 4 or so. : )
amanda
ps I've been posting anonymously, but now I have a user name...Yea!
| Anonymous
Anonymous Poster
From Internet Network:
62.252.64.x | posted: 5/12/2006 at 8:57:43 PM ET
you guys really need to get over yourself, I cant beleive how unappreciative you are, as for the person talking about its 'Bernadette's career low' pur-lease!! I (and every one else) should be just happy and grateful. After her dreadful year I thought I may never see her on tv or anywhere else again. I haven't even seen the episode because im in england. But I dont care because at least millions of people got to see the bernadette who we know and love, she may even get more roles after this. Its will and grace guys!!! not curb....., arrested development etc. You all sound like Theatrical thespians critising hairspray or the full monty!
I really hope bernadette did not read this site (because she probably does) to see what you guys thought, because after some of the comments made she might not even do tv spots anymore. I understand if you didn't enjoy the episode, but what frustrates me is the fact that I think Bernadette did this show for her fans, to say thankyou for the support and im ok!!
Please be grateful and respectful
*I've only ever felt dissapointed in bernadettes projects when she has been under used i.e alice, the odyssey, annie, what the deaf man heard, etc
| Sister Rose
Registered User
Registered:
5/4/2004
From:
NYC | posted: 5/12/2006 at 11:04:37 PM ET
This evening, I am re-reading some of Martin Gottfried's biography of Angela Lansbury - I just came across the section about the movies that she was doing before her Broadway musicals career and I thought this sort of applied to the talk about Bernadette (or even other actors) taking certain roles. About "Blue Hawaii" Angela said, "I was a freelance. It was a professional job. I was well paid. It was a lovely location. There were good costumes and attention to detail. It was a good cast - and Elvis was a very nice young man in those days. And so I did it. I'm not apologizing for it. I was a journeyman actor. I did what was proffered. If it was applicable to my talents and I could bring it off, I would do it. As long as I got the billing and the money. That was the important thing - and that I didn't disgrace myself."
Perhaps Bernadette - and others - feel the same way. It is afterall their livelihood and they still have to pay the bills. God knows that's why I work where I do (that's the only reason).
http://sarahbsadventures.blogspot.com/
| Karen
Registered User
Registered:
5/3/2002 | posted: 5/13/2006 at 12:14:55 AM ET
I think Lansbury's quote, coming strictly from the performer's viewpoint, is just about right. For Bernadette this was just a job. She's an actor and is limited to taking the roles available in the kinds of projects being produced. She has no control over whether the general tone of television in a given era is elevated, degraded, or somewhere in between.
But I'm not an actor or an actor's agent. Their professional concerns and self-interests are not mine. I'm strictly a member of the audience and if I'm appalled about the quality of what's being offered, then I feel free to express that.
Here's another quote. This is from Wallace Shawn, in an interview he did years ago: "I often think that the main thing a good piece of art can do is make the person looking at it more intelligent. It sharpens the brains of the person who's experiencing it. Most films or plays or articles you read actually leave you stupider than you were before you experienced them and leave you on a sort of low, ignorant, monsterlike level somehow. If you see a mindless movie where the plot makes no sense, the characters are incoherently written and self-contradictory, the observations of life are lazy and false, it harms you a little bit, and if you watch six hours of it on television every night for your whole life, it may make you really into an idiot."
In order for this forum to host discussions that have any sort of substance or interest, the participants have to feel free to say what they think. Some of us hated the show, some of us liked it, some of us thought others were taking it all too seriously. I'm glad we all feel comfortable enough here to come out with our honest reactions. If we felt obligated to censor our true thoughts then the whole enterprise would be pretty worthless.
As far as Bernadette is concerned, I very much doubt that she reads this site. Even if she did, she would certainly not be offended by or influenced in her choice of future work by anything said here. And this is just my opinion, but I think she did Will & Grace simply because it was a job and something different, not in order "to say thank you" to her fans for their support.
|  MsPetersFan1
Registered User
Registered:
6/25/2002
From:
Long Island, New York & Boston, | posted: 5/13/2006 at 1:30:53 AM ET
anonymous -
i don't want to start a fight here, but i disagree with your post. Firstly, as Bernadette fans who have followed her throughout her career and know her as a performer better than any old news reporter doing a review of a show, I think that we have every right to criticize something Bernadette was in. We in no way criticized HER, just the role she was playing and the material (which was not her fault). Just because we don't like something she's in does not mean we don't appreciate it - of course we are all thrilled she was in a prime time spot - we just think it wasn't the best show.
That being said, I think we can all agree that we are very appreciative and amazed by Bernadette's ability to perform after what she's been through.
And as for Bernadette reading this site? I highly doubt that. Can you honestly picture Bernadette sitting at home and reading our posts? I think she has more important things to be doing. And even if by chance she did read our posts - you think that she would not do TV spots just because 30 people didn't like her in ONE episode of Will and Grace?
I don't get the vibe that she did this show "for her fans." I believe her continuing with her concerts across the country merely 3 weeks after her husband died is dedication to her fans, not a 30 minute episode of Will & Grace where she can't "connect" with the audience.
Once again let me reiterate - we all are not criticizing Bernadette, simply the material she was presented with. We are disappointed and have every right to be.
~* Megan *~
|  Jenny_loves_
bernadette
Registered User
Registered:
6/6/2002
From:
London | posted: 5/13/2006 at 6:55:37 AM ET
ok - i just got a little scared as anonymous said he/she lived in england. Its not me! hehe. I've been reading the whole post and I must say i'm really suprised - i thought will and grace was really popular but so many of you don't seem to like it. I like when I see it but i don't go out of my way to tune in - its way too many gags a minute and tries to be a bit too clever for its own good. it makes my brain hurt with the effort of keeping up.
The sad thing is, i have to say, is so many brits - particularly teenagers, think this is just how americans are. We get an absolute TON of U.S sitcoms more so than dramas or anything else for that matter. channel 4 shows pretty much all of them; friends, the simpsons, everybody loves raymond, roseanne, just shoot me, frasier, cheers, mad about you, 8 simple rules, hope and faith(sooo appalling) and the list goes on.
But i guess you can say that while some brits might think americans are wise-cracking, cheesey self absorbed caricatures, people in america have this view of the english, particularly, being snobbish, rude, and cold-hearted from all the shows that get exported from here.
I've just been ranting pointlessly - sorry!
But back to the point, I'm really looking forward to Bernadette being on mainstream TV. and anyway, aren't we forgetting some of the appalling movies she's made that we let go because we love her to bits? Tulips and heartbeeps for example?
they say bernadette's wonderful..........and she is
xx Jenny xx
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